[captioning made possible by fox news channel] captioned by the national captioning institute ---www.ncicap.org--- >> three, two, one, beck! glenn: welcome to the glenn beck program. tonight we have some information on the czars an statements that should horrify america and connections to some other people and to the white house and what it means for your healthcare in the future, particularly if you are elderly, handicapped or have a very young child. if you believe this country is great but that government healthcare is taking us in directions we promised ourselves we would never go down again, stand up. come, follow me.

hello, america. tonight i ask you to stay with the program. this is not a sound byte program tonight, although it will be taken out of context and it will be used and it will be called fear mongering. what i call this is question with boldness. questions that need answers. we must have answers. i am only following the directions of the president of the united states. he told us how to find out what he really believes and that's exactly what we're going to do. in a couple of minutes, we're going to talk about healthcare, the views of obama's czars and his close advisors and why it's important to look there. it's important to know where they stand, but first, i want to start someplace to show you the beginnings of and the history of eugenics, which means basically creating a master race by discouraging

reproduction with people with genetic defects and other undesirable traits. now, i know right now the people who are writing their blogs in the basement are saying, oh, my gosh, we got him now, glenn is saying eugenics is coming. no, i'm not. i'm not saying anything like that at all. eugenics are not coming. eugenics have been wildly discredited by the nazis an only truly evil people would go down that road, but it did happen, and it's important that we look at that time period, because there is a lot we can learn from the past mistakes that led to that point. please watch this. eugenics did not start with the nazis but with brittish and socialist progressives who thought through birth control they could cure the ills of modern society, such as more public hygiene, rising

population among lower classes and crowding. indiana passed the first law in 1907 for criminals. and 29 other states followed suit along with canada and most of europe. eugenics infected the mind-set of individuals such as the leader of the individualism movement of the early 20th century herbert crowley. he wrote a book called "the promise of american life" in which he declared that the state must, quote, interfere on behalf of the really fittest. eugenics was popular thought to woodrow wilson, teddy roosevelt and their advisors. in 1912, a year before he was president, new jersey's governor woodrow wilson created a board of examiners of feeble minded, epileptics and other defectives. und it, the state could determine when procreation is inadvisable like for criminals, prisoners, poor kids and the ill defined.

other defectives, end quote. roosevelt's close advisor charles van highs said "he who thinks of himself not primarily but of his race and his future is the new patriot, end quote. former president roosevelt later endorsed madison grant's passing of "the great race" a book that lit hitler once referred to as his bible. what the textbooks ignore is that before the nazis took power, germans lagged behind americans an europeans in eugenics but world war i and the great flu pandemic turned doctors into social planners. hitler and the nazis took the logic of total health to totalitarian extremes making the central policy goal affecting marriage, medicine and more. the same year hitler joined the nazi party in 1920, the nazis rounded up hundreds of thousands of disabled, elderly and mentally ill an exterminated them, as quote,

useless bread gobblers or life unworthy of life, end quote. back to america. eugenics was beings effectively written into the constitution. in the buck versus bell case in 1927, progressive lawyers stood on the flimsy ground of a massachusetts vaccination law to keep terry buck from reproducing. we know now she wasn't retarded, but to add insult to injury, justice oliver wendell holmes infamously wrote, quote, three generations of imbeciles are enough, end quote. 7 years later, hitler wrote to the president of the american eugenic society to ask for a copy of his famous case for sterilize sterilization, which called for sterilization of some ten million americans forced. the nazis sterilized over 50,000 unfit germans which caused an american genesis to complain, quote, the germans are breetsing us at their own game.

the nazi-genic idea involved naturally into the eventual holocaust and the deaths of 6 million jews as well as millions of others, all innocent. glenn: america, there is so much anger and hatred in this country right now, and it is important that we have an honest conversation here and understand clear what is being said on this program. no one is saying that eugenics are coming. the builder of the master race was only part of the problem in germany, made possible after they began to devalue life. they tried to figure out how much is a life worth and put a price on how much each individual was worth, and some were worth more than others. i want to show you a poster that i saw this morning getting ready for the show. i want you to know that i have

a daughter that was born with cerebral palsy and they said when she was born that she would never walk or talk. or feed herself she went to college. they were wrong. this poster bothers me so much because the hand of the person shown in this poster reminds me of my -- reminds me of my daughter's hand. this is from nazi germany. it says in german, if you can get a tight shot here, it says in german, basically "it's going to cost 60 thousand marks to keep this man alive. as you see, he's sitting here with a gnarled hand. he's a sweet guy and everything, the poster says, but his quality of life is a shame, but your time is up." there is this pos sters.

this is also from germany in world war ii. this one shows an institution here and all of the houses that could be built with the money if we just eliminate this institution. now here is what the president of the united states has told us today -- >> the rumor that's been circulating a lot lately is this idea that somehow the house of representatives voted for death panels that will basically pull the plug on grandma because we have decided that we don't -- it's too expensive to let her live anymore. the intention of the members of congress was to give people more information so that they could handle issues of end-of-life care when they're ready on their own terms

>> i don't believe this is for laughter or jokes. no one wants to kill your grandmother or unplug your grandmother t would be a truly evil person that would do that. however, what happened in germany was that they couldn't afford healthcare for all. you see, they had devalued their mark, our dollar. they had devalued it so much because the government just started to print money. does that sound familiar? it has only been done a few times in the world's history, and it has never ended up any other different way than it did in the vimar republic. that forced germany into an economic collapse. america, i ask you to take a good long hard look at what's going on today. you must ask with boldness, could our economy, the way we

are currently spending and printing at will possibly go into some sort of emergency situation? could it collapse? is it possible? is it possible that our debt is so high that we can't pay it back or we have to make tough decisions and possibly ration healthcare? the answer everyone will tell you is yes, so then is it crazy, is it ridiculous to say, all right, if we have a crisis in our monetary system, what will our government and our president do to figure that out what he's going to think or thinks currently, we need to listen to his words on how to decide what his policies -- he told us this in the campaign, so we're only following his directions. listen carefully, and figure out how to decide what his policies are going to be, and what they are. >> let me tell you who i

associate with. on economic policy, i associate with warren buffett and former fed chairman paul volcker. if i am interested in figuring out my foreign policy, i associate myself with my running mate joe biden, or with dick lugar or jen general jim jones, former supreme camed commander of nato. they have shaped my ideas and will be surrounding me in the white house. glenn: america, this program is under a great amount of pressure to not bring you this news. i would ask that you listen carefully. we will do exactly what obama himself has told us to do. we have to find out about his advisors. who is shaping his opinion? who is surrounding him? we know it's not based in eugenics but what is it?

these are the people he will call in a crisis situation. right now that is what people are talking about. we are only talking about if there is a crisis what will they do? whose voice will the president hear? well, there's dr. ezekiel emanuel, a health advisor. he said this in january of this year. quote, when implemented, the complete lives system produces a priority curve on which individuals aged between roughly 15 and 40 years get the most chance, whereas the youngest and oldest people get chances that are aten ewated. the science czar, john holdren says, quote, the fetus, given the opportunity to develop properly before birth and given the essentially -- given the essential early socializing experiences and sufficient nourishing food during the cue shall early years after birth will develop into a human

being." he also, this czar, wrote about putting sterilants in drinking water for population control. one of the leaders in this type of thought is a friend of the regulatory czar, cass sunstein. cass sunstein, the regulatory czar is the guy who will take the big bill and make regulations to point us in the right direction. one of his good friends is princeton professor peter singer. in last july in "the new york times", peter singer wrote "why we must ration healthcare ." he wants to do it now. in that, he talked about the number of lives we could save. saving the life of one teenager is equivalent to saving the lives of how many 85-year-olds? his answer is 14. you also have rahm emanuel

brother ezekiel saying this "providing services to individuals who are prevented from becoming participating citizens are not basic and should not be guaranteed." that leads me to sarah palin's statement this week on facebook. she said this "who will suffer the most when they ration care? the sick, the elderly, the disabled, of course. the america i know does not love one in which my parents or baby with downs syndrome will have to stand in front of obama's death panel, so bureaucrats can decide, based on subjective judgment of their level of productivity in society, whether they are worthy of healthcare. such a system is downright evil." is it truly crazy to have these conversations? this is the stuff that they're now saying out loud. what are they say together president behind closed doors when we aren't there to watch him? i guess we won't know, because we will all be too focused on

the emergency that would start the rationing, and the czars don't have to answer to anyone. before i introduce you to my panel, i want to show you one more thing. this is a poster from germany. see if this rings a bell to anyone or looks familiar just in a different kind of media. this is something that translates here at the bottom to the complainer. can you zoom in on this one? these are four men. notice how ugly they are. how some of them look rich or fat or whatever, maybe jewish, maybe this one, i don't know. they're all the complainers. they're all standing around in a circle, and they're talking about -- they're all standing around in a circle talking about how horrible things are, and how we shouldn't do this. the parade, back here, are the supporters. this is a poster of what you see every day now in the news media making the complainers, the tea partygoers look

somehow rotten. r.j.postreto is the author of woodrow will son" and carter sneed is with university of notre dame and counsel to president bush's council of bioethics, john hoff, former health and human services official in the bush administration. gentlemen, first of all, does anybody here believe ewe jenics is coming, building a master race? >> absolutely not. glenn: ok, good. we're all clear on that. that's not what we're saying. does anybody here believe that barack obama wants to snuff out anybody's grandma? >> absolutely not. glenn: so what is the connection to what i've just been saying? >> well, i think what you're pointing out is that in any system where the government allocates scarce resources to the population based on its own judgments about who is entitled to receive benefits, and more importantly who is not entitled to receive the benefits, there are serious issues and questions, very serious questions about

possible discrimination and injustice. who is going to bear the burden of the regime? who is not going to get the treatments, and i think those are serious questions to raise, questions about fairness, and all of the proposals that have been floated so far in the public square raise those kinds of questions. peter singer is the most obvious one because his program is indifferent to fairness and distribution. but others, even zeke emanuel, a thoughtful person, his proposal and his curve raises similar questions about how the weakest and most sulker inable will do under these regime. glenn: i'm not saying that any of these people -- i mean, these are conversations in ak deem ya that you should have. i'm not saying that the statements are inherently evil. it is in the implementation of things where it always goes awry. john, the complete lives system, the president says he has no intention of rationing, yet, at the same time, they say we're already rationing, so what is the complete lives

system? >> well, you have quoted one sentence from the article that emanuel had written, and basically it says that we will value young people more than old people, but not all young people, because the very young, we have no investment in, whereas the 15, 25-year-old we have invested money in, therefore they're more valuable, and the people who would mainly benefit, i think as you read it, were people 15-40. this is not discrimination, it says, because after all, the 65-year-olds have the chance to be 25, which is incredible, but in the article, they say this is not -- they apply it to organ allocation for organ transplant. they say it is, quote, premature to apply this to the healthcare system as a whole. now, i don't know what turns it into maturity. glenn: let me ask you, r.j. historically, didn't the t-4

project in germany. are you familiar with the t-4 project? i think it is the t-4 project. it is was the baby nawrts was a horribly crippled blind, deaf, i think, didn't have two limbs out of four. they said it was going to be a horrible life. the parents said, please, doctors, please put him out of his misery, and hitler came to the forefront and said i will do it. it started as compassionate, and then it went awry. do you see any parallels in history at all where an emergency would kick us into rationing? >> well, i think the point that you made is the most important to underscore, which is we are talking about healthcare rationing, and president obama was giving a town hall meelts meeltsing earlier this afternoon where he was insisting that nothing could be further from the truth, but the fact is when you are extending benefits to so many and you are talking

about reducing costs, it doesn't even have to take an emergency. government officials are going to have to be in the position of deciding how to allocate scarce resources. this means that someone is going to have to be responsible to whom care is going to be given. we have a history of that in this country of government coming in and deciding, well, maybe certain lives aren't worth as much. glenn: when i come back, i want to start there. you know, when you start valuing life differently, and we have all right started on that path, and i want to talk about that tree and so much more, when we come back. more, when we come back. don't go anywhere. ♪ bicycle, what are we waiting for? the flowers are blooming. the air is sweet.

and zyrtec® starts... relieving my allergies... 2 hours faster than claritin®. my worst symptoms feel better, indoors and outdoors. with zyrtec®, the fastest... 24-hour allergy medicine, i promise not to wait as long to go for our ride. zyrtec® works fast, so i can love the air™. being smart. yep. just booked my 10th night on hotels.com, so i get a night free. you are smart. accumulate 10 nights and get a night free anywhere. welcome rewards. smart. so smart. 90s slacker hip-hop. ♪ that can strain your relationships and hurt yourody 'cause we'pride ♪ng a ride ♪ ♪ it's the credit roller aster ♪ ♪ and as you can see it kinda bites! ♪ ♪ so sing the lyrics with me: ♪ when your debt goes up your score goes down ♪ ♪ when you pay a little off it goes the other way 'round ♪ ♪ it's just the same for everybody, every boy and girl ♪ ♪ the credit roller coaster makes you wanna hurl ♪ ♪ so throw your hands in the air, and wave 'em around ♪ ♪ like a wanna-be frat boy trying to get down ♪

♪ then bring 'em right back to where your laptop's at... ♪ ♪ log on to free credit report dot com - stat! ♪ vo: free credit score and report with enrollment in triple advantage.

glenn: hello, america. we have a special tonight on some information that i don't think you're going to get anywhere else. i'm sar sorry i'm going to go charlie rose on you tonight but i brought on big brains to help discuss this so we can ask bold questions, and then look for answers. these are important questions. we're about to change america. r.j.postreto is author of woodrow wilson's art of liberal liberalism.

you will learn things you never knew in history. carter sneed, associate professor of law, university of notre dame, former council on president bush's bioethics group, and gentlemen, you two, particularly, i have to say this, i'm going to get hammered for not only doing this show, but also because you're both in the bush administration. you were both in the bush administration. either of you guys want to address that you are not just a hired gun for the g.o.p.? >> i have no talking points and we're free. we're free. >> i'm an academic, so i can say whatever i like. glenn: ok. i want to come back to where we were. before we go to the chalkboard, i want to go back to where we were on valuing life. what do you see there? >> yeah, my sense, again, just to reit reiterate, it seems to me that the chief concern i have about any sort of program like this is who bears the burden? whose lives get devalued in terms of allocation of

resources, and if you look back at the chart, at the curve that dr. emanuel put up and getting back to my friend john's point about how newborns their lives are valued in a less weighty fashion than older children, even, it is because of the amount of investment that adolescents have received, but also there is a striking statement in dr. emanuel's piece in which he says that infants, in comparing them to adolescents, don't yet have a developed personality capable of forming and evaluating long-term plans whose full fulfillment requires a complete life that. is a moral judgment about the status of a new born child that is a very contested an controversial position and results did deleterious effects on that child's well being and entitlement to resources, and i think that's something that we need to notice and take seriously. glenn: we're not even arguing when does life begin, if it's at conception or at birth. now we're saying life doesn't

really begin -- peter singer says it is not until the child can recognize that there is a tomorrow. you could have killed ronald reagan. you could kill any child up to, he says, two-ish. that's where we're headed here. >> we r. you have a situation where they are sub-person human beings, that are not quite persons or no longer persons. he fights ronald dworkin, but i have to say a similar thing about unborn children. in addition to devaluing the lives of newborns in that one proposal, if you combine the incentives for cost containment with federal funding for abortion, you might well end up with a edge are sqeem in which there is a huge pressure on parents to abort a child who has a disability, and you can understand why people like sarah palin are upset about that, people who have children with disabilities, and i think that's something that we kind of have a discrimination that we need to talk about, not just for those children but for people living with

disabilities that are rin tolerant of perfection from which those kinds of decisions are played. glenn: my daughter has taught me more than any other person that i have ever been around. she had 13 strokes at birth. she teaches me something every day. without that imperfection, you cannot find the truth without imperfection. go ahead. >> there is a lot of misleading statements, also, about the abortion coverage and the healthcare plan, glenn, and carter is exactly right. i saw senator claire mccaskill at one of these town halls that we have seen so much of on the news, and in response to a question, she was claiming, well, this's absolutely nothing in any of these bills about abortion. technically she is right. there isn't anything in these bills about abortion, but the way the law works, what the courts have ruled on this is when the law is silent, the abortion is considered to be a medical procedure or medical benefit that has to be

covered. that is why we need things such as the hyde amend mentd that we have had in the past where you have explicit prohibitions. technically, it's true. there is nothing about abortions in these bills which means it will be covered. glenn: they have fought tooth and nail to keep out hang waj language that excluded abortions. glenn: when we come back from the break, i want to talk about the end of life things that are in there and the misdirection there. america, important decisions to make. you have to know who you are, who we are as a nation, who we are as people, and when you become a person or when you lose your personhood. this is the world we're living in today. more with my guests in justhat t most for headaches. for arthritis pain... in your hands... knees... and back. for little bodies with fevers..

and big bodies on high blood pressure medicine. tylenol works with your body... in a way other pain relievers don't... so you feel better... knowing doctors recommend tylenol... more than any other brand of pain reliever.

hourme at the top of the for "special report." now back to glenn. glenn: hello, america. tonight we're doing a special show, and i urge you to take this and bring it to your friends, show it to your friends. pass on the information that you see here. r.j. pastreto, and carter sneed and john hoff, former health and human services official in the bush administration are here. we're talking about healthcare. today, i saw the president give his speech, and he said, you know, some of these guys on that other network that are

always trying to dig at me say i'm going to snuff out your grandma. i believe he was -- i believe he may have been talking about me, which i don't believe he is going to try to kill your grandmother, and consequently, guys, i think he is talking about you. >> guilt by association. glenn: guilt by association. we were talking about abortion and beginning of life and how it will be covered in healthcare, even though they say there's nothing in this bill that says anything about that. you say it is in there by design. >> it is in there by design. there is nothing in the bill about anything. that's the point i want to get to that and i want to get to the end-of-life part of the bill. glenn: go ahead. >> the beryl has a provision for a benefit which is to determine what benefits of the plan will be. it doesn't say anything other than certain minimums like hospital care, so this commission or this committee,

which will be 27 people, appointed by the president and by the government accountability office, will make the decisions. they will decide what is covered and presumably under what circumstances. once you start down this road of defining what a benefit is, you can define anything you want. glenn: the president said today, he was trying to debunk some of these things, and he said, look, we just want people to have a conversation with their doctor at end of life so they know what is available so they can make decisions. >> that's end of life. that is section 1233, which has become really something. it is ten pages in which they provided that they are going to pay for the doctor to talk to the patient about end of life, but it sounds perfectly innocuous except why did they add it? they could have added it if they just wanted to do payment. they could have added it in one sentence. what is really worrisome about this is that it gets -- it tells -- the government is

telling the doctor what the conversation with the patient should be, and i have real problems with this. in fact, the doctor has to give legal advice as to what the different instruments mean. it reminds me that the doctor hay say may say to the patient, i'm not a lawyer, but i play one for medicare. that's what is going to be involved. the idea is that it is voluntary. two things. one, the doctor gets paid for doing it, so you believe doctors will do things because they will get paid, which is why they are putting it in there, they will do, it and secondly, something that nobody has mentioned before, he gets judged on his quality points as to whether or not he makes or has this conversation. obviously he is going to do it, and then the white coat appears to the poor woman who has just been diagnosed with

pancreatic cancer. what do you think her pressure is when she is counting on this person to treat her in the future? glenn: i want to play a chip that i played at the beginning of the show. this is explaining why we're doing this, especially this next segment. i want to you listen. this is during the campaign when people were asking how do we know, because he was always very vague on, what, give me my change. he said you want to know what my policies are, look to the people around me. here is what he said. >> let me tell you who i associate with. on economic policy, warren buffett and former fed chairman paul volcker. if i'm interested in figuring out foreign policy, i associate myself with joe biden, or with dick lugar, the republican ranking member on the senate foreign relations committee, or general jim jones, the former supreme allied commander of nato. those are the people, democrats and republicans, who have shaped my ideas, and who will be surrounding me in the white house. glenn: ok. so, who is surrounding him?

here is healthcare. what are the roots of healthcare? who are surrounding him? i'm going to introduce you to these people and ask you this question -- why is van jones, the green jobs movement, why is he so interested in your healthcare? healthcare? when we come back. ♪ bicycle, what are we waiting for? the flowers are blooming. the air is sweet. and zyrtec® starts... relieving my allergies... 2 hours faster than claritin®. my worst symptoms feel better, indoors and outdoors. with zyrtec®, the fastest... 24-hour allergy medicine, i promise not to wait as long to go for our ride.

zyrtec® works fast, so i can love the air™.

in our nation's all-volunteer armed forces have made a commitment to protect us and our freedoms. many of them will return from the war on terror with missing limbs, severe burns, or traumatic brain injuries. back home, these soldiers will begin a new battle, the often difficult journey to get their lives back on track. the wounded warrior project was created to help and support these injured heroes

through programs that deliver needed supplies to their hospital bedsides, and through services that bring together veterans who have faced similar injuries and issues, to support each other during their recovery. the wounded warrior project's motto is, "the greatest casualty is being forgotten." regardless of your position on the war, these brave men and women deserve our support. please consider the many ways that you could get involved. to learn more, call... or visit woundedwarriorproject.org.

glenn: tonight we're talking a little bit about healthcare and going into the universal healthcare tree and obama. he told us if you want to know about his policies you have to look at the people you surround himself with. that is the roots of the tree. who is helping him make decisions? i want to say something, we have said about the idea that it all starts out really well, and this then goes awry. germany went awry because they

ran out of money and they had to make tough choices and then crazy people. as we tell you the roots, tell me if these people, not that they're crazy, but tell me if they are mainstream thinkers. we have carter sneed and john hoff, former health and human services official in the bush administration. ok. where do we even start on the roots of the tree here, guys? who is the spookiest part of this root system? >> well, let me just say, first of all, you have to say that cass sunstein and ezekiel emanuel are two of the most impressive and thoughtful people in public life. we can't tar them with any sort of pejorative expressions but -- glenn: i want to make sure i haven't said anything. i said early on in the show, these people have a right to participate in these conversations. >> we understand, absolutely. i wanted to say, what i think

that underscores, cass sunstein is one of the most prominent regulatory affairs people in the country and ezekiel emanuel one of the most thoughtful physician assessors in the country. sunstein has worked on regulatory reform, systems of allocation that raise the kind of discriminatory injustice things that we have talked about. even thoughtful, brilliant people that are well intentioned can produce systems that raise serious questions. if you look between them, you have holdren, who is obama's science advisor, who has said some things that are in print, actually, in a book he co-authored with pauler lick, which i think you covered before, some extreme measures for population reduction. glenn: forced abortions, sterilants in drinking water. i believe it was -- was it sunstein or holdren? does anybody in the control room that would talk about taking children away from unfit parents? >> that must have been holdren. sunstein wouldn't say that.

glenn: not mainstream, and i'm sorry. i have respect for the thinking of sunstein, but look, if he is advising obama, look who he is connected with as a good friend, peter singer. peter singer is, i'm sorry, but -- well, he's out of his mind if you look at him as mainstream. >> peter singer is interesting in that he is the most -- he is sort of the purest example of an allocation regime that sutterly indifferent to fairness. i mean, he wants to just maximize the total number of, what is it, quality-adjusted life years. that's consistent with what he argued in "the new york times" magazine, and so, as you say, these are all variations on the same theme. how do you divide up the pie and how does the government make judgments about who is entitled to care and who is not? glenn: is there any doubt from anybody here that we are putting ourselves in a situation -- forget about healthcare. we are putting ourselves in a situation where our debt is going to be tripling and so everything this country does

we will have to make tough decisions? >> that's true about everything the government does. they have to make decisions with limited resources about where pharma subsidies are going to go, and who is going to get highway money who, is going to get a bridge. what we're doing is taking healthcare, even with the very best intentions, we're taking healthcare and bringing it under that same kind of prodigy. glenn: we have one of the pieces that is money. you will have a problem with money, and the second is crazy people. i don't think any of these people are crazy but the people underneath in the root system, one is a communist that believes in forced abortions, legal rights for animals, and babies are not human. >> ok. well, that doesn't sound too nuts to me. ly explain this connection, my guys brush their teeth like they clean their room. i'm glad anticavity

listerine® smart rinse™ attracts stuff like a magnet, then shows it in the sink. ewww. gross. cool! (announcer) listerine® smart rinse™. save, visit sterinekids.com

glenn: tonight, a special on healthcare reform, and i ask you to tape the show and pass it along. we have john hoff with us a former health and humans services official in the bush administration and here is the trio bouma says here is how i make decisions and look at how who i surround myself with. we have spent time over here. there is so much more to cover but i want to talk to you about the green movement root. i couldn't figure out why the green movement -- here is van jones, a convicted felon, a guy who spent six months in prison after the rodney king beating. he was a black nationalist. he came out an anarchist and communist. he found the green mox was the new red and now he is a a new greens czar. why is there green movement money here? these people are paying people

to go into healthcare on craigslist. professor here and acorn and soros funneling money here. why would the green people be doing this? may i make a connection and see if anybody agrees with did. holdren is the key to understand the green movement. how many people in the green movement -- holdren says we have too many people. we should have forced sterilizations, forced abortions. the population is too big. how many people in the green movement think that people are a virus? i think that's a connection. anybody? nobody wants -- >> well, i think the important thing to realize here is the connection between the green movement and healthcare might have something to do with the fact that the green movement isn't so much about green movement. it may be a bigger notion that leads to social problems, too.

glenn: barack obama says he is against reparations because they don't go far enough. universal education and universal healthcare is a way to hen the underprivileged. the green movement is about -- is really van jones, at least, is about social justice and spreading the wealth, communism. maybe the green movement is that front you're talking about, and maybe that's just his way of spreading the wealth and moving all that money into social justice through healthcare. no? carter? >> no, i was thinking of something else, actually. i was thinking about the irony of what both of you were saying about the principle rational and argument for this healthcare initiative is to provide coverage to a broader group of people, people who aren't currently covered but as i was saying before, any kind of system where the government is picking winners and losers, there will be serious risks of gave injustices and that is an ironic feature of this whole

discussion, the raggal is to -- rational is to cover everyone but the mechanism to do that will be to discriminate against certain groups of people. glenn: they will say we have a horrible system now because it discriminates against people now. anyone want to address that? >> i want to speak to that briefly. no one here is defending the current system as a perfect paradigm system, but i think this is a moral difference between the government picking winners and losers and winners and losers emerging from a process of aggregated individual choices that people are making. certainly, there are people that are not able to make choices because they surfer from serious inequalities and the solution, and i'm no policy expert, john is, but to raise those people up so they can make choices rather than scap the entire system of choices in favor of a government position. glenn: i want to thank your for my arthritis, i use

new capzasin quick relief gel. (announcer) starts working on contact and at the nerve level. to block pain for hours. new capzasin, takes the pain out of arthritis. new aveeno nourish plus. active naturals wheat formulas proven to target and help repair damage in just three washes. - building shiny, strong... - hair with life. announcer: new aveeno nourish plus.

.

glenn: america, i told you that the blogs would be on fire about this show. they got out of it that i cried. god help us all. how we cannot have a serious conversation in this country, how we cannot talk about things that are truly, truly important. last night i left you with the idea and i want to leave it with you again, question with boldness. don't let anybody tell you not to question things and then listen to the